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I've been meaning to write this story for some time. Since I just told part of it to masteralida this morning, and versions of it to Tripitaka, gondhir, jereeza, and sui_degeneris over the last few months, I figured now is as good a time as any.
immortalvisions, LV, csn, and other current CS/CogSci (f00dave, prolog, twinbee, deire, yahvah) and academia-bound (jereeza, auriam, oikade, narvi, figgylicious) students: this is for you.

For those of you who don't know, I skipped the last two years of high school at Severn School 1 and started my undergraduate program at Johns Hopkins University with sophomore standing. This is the reason I completed a concurrent B.S./Master's program in 1993, when I was 19, and earned a doctorate in computer science when I was 24.


A little background is in order. In 1983, my father (a chemical engineer) moved to Somerville, NJ to take a position at J. M. Huber. The recession had hit the phosphates industry hard, and Davy McKee, the company where he had worked before, had laid off about half of its staff. My dad jumped at the opportunity to take a new job, even though the position wasn't a perfect match, because my mom had two younger sisters who lived in Piscataway and Hillsboro, respectively. 2 To date, I had only ever attended Catholic-run preschools and Baptist primary schools. Fifth grade was my first experience with public school, but that is another story for another time.

Something interesting that happened when I started fifth grade at Hillsboro School was that my math/science and English/history teachers noticed that I was significantly ahead of most other students in reading and problem-solving aptitude, and sent me to be screened for the school Gifted and Talented (GT) program. The screen test consisted of an oral interview where the GT teacher posed problems ranging from numerical sequence memorization to analogies, geometric and analytical reasoning. I must have done well, for a week later, I had joined one of my best friends, Ari Chakravarty, in the GT class. The next four months were four of the happiest in my life. I will tell you about them another time. I read voraciously, on everything from Greco-Roman mythology (my favorite subject other than entomology and space travel; I liked paleontology, but not fanatically so - ants and the Odyssey were my passions at 10). I got my first computer on my tenth birthday, became hooked on BASIC "programming" (really hacking code listings from books and magazines), and became really hooked on futurist books such as the Usborne Future Cities/Robots/Space Travel series by Gatland and Jeffries. I wrote a lot - future city blueprints, sketches of various SF short stories (some of which I finished in high school), video game ideas, and fanfic ideas (for a Narnia miniseries, for a Return of The Jedi sequel, etc.). Then my dad switched jobs again and we had to move back to Florida. I was momentarily devastated. Overnight, I came down with a massive throat infection, that persisted for nearly two weeks, or about a week into a month-long trip we took to Taiwan.

After returning to the States, I enrolled at Plant City Elementary for about six weeks and participated a little in the fifth grade GT program, such as it was, but the teacher and I never clicked. The fact that 90% of the kids at this school were blooming idiots might have something to do with it.

Then, in July of 1984, we moved back to Lakeland, FL. I didn't get along with my homeroom teacher or the computer teacher (yet another story), but Mrs. Holland, the Alpha (GT program) teacher, was my hero. She let us have tremendous amounts of free time to do everything from scripting and recording our own one-person comedy and dramatic skits to conducting exigeses of Encyclopedia Brown and Madeleine L'Engle's Time Trilogy (A Wrinkle in Time, A Wind in The Door, A Swiftly Tilting Planet). By the winter of 1984-1985, though, my father had gotten the chance to return to Smith-Corona Mettalurgicals (SCM) Chemicals, the company he left to move to FL. He went up to MD for six months while my mother and I stayed in Florida.

Why am I digressing into my pre-CTY history, you may well ask?
Well, those of us CTYers who've been through good GT programs and then lost them due to parental job-related relocation can tell you: it seems like a small thing to adults, but to the gifted child, it has the melodramatic quality of an amputation.

By June, 1985, I was busy plotting world (or at least school) domination. Unfortunately, I had but a vague notion of how to carry out my plan without henchpeople. Fortunately for me, this seventh grade year coincided with the CTY Talent Search. I took the SAT and scored 1250 (600 Verbal, 650 Math) and 43 on the TSWE. This put me in the Regional Award (second highest) category and made me eligible for CTY programs (430V/500M were the cutoffs at the time).

I attended three sessions of CTY, all commuter programs:


  • JHU, summer 1986: MATH - Algebra II (3 weeks), College Algebra (3 weeks)

  • JHU, fall 1986: MATH - College Algebra (6 weeks), Trigonometry (6 weeks)

  • JHU, summer 1987: MATH - Analytic Geometry (6 weeks)



As you can see, I was quite insanely ambitious when I was 12. JHU's commuter program was a 6-week one that lasted through both residential sessions. Being quite oblivious to own limitations, I attempted to finish both an Algebra II course during CTY Session I and an "Algebra III" course during Session II. I actually succeeded in passing the Algebra II standardized test with the requisite 90th percentile score, but did not pass the Algebra III test. I repeated the course for six weeks in the fall, and again fell a little short (80th or 85th %ile). I remember feeling very discouraged for a single day, and wholly determined to rock precalculus on its heels the next. (At this time, I was taking eighth-grade Geometry at Severna Park Middle School.)

In June and July of 1987, I took Analytic Geometry and barely made the 90th percentile cutoff (by one question). I was then 13 and in the process of going from Severna Park Middle to Severn. That fall, I went to the Upper School head, Julian Domenech, and asked for permission to file a course sequence that would allow me to graduate in two years, by the end of tenth grade. Mr. Domenech was skeptical at the time, but receptive, and informed me that I would have to carry a double course load. "No problem," I grinned.

I started Advanced Placement (AP) Calculus AB in August, 1987. My teacher, Beth Francis MacCallum, was very good - and noticed right away that I seemed a little out of my depth. I picked things up quickly enough to score a 5 on the AP exam, though. You would have thought I'd won the lottery to hear me crowing and strutting around in May, 1988.

By this time I had started taking summer courses at Anne Arundel Community College (AACC). In the fall of 1987, I took an introductory FORTRAN programming course with my dad at AACC every Saturday. Between this and the math team, I had quite a busy schedule. The next spring, I took Fundamentals of Biology and aced all the exams. I figured I could simply add evening and summer courses.

In the summers of 1988 and 1989 I took General Chemistry I and II (with labs); on evenings and weekends, I took Composition and Literature; and by distance learning (a cable TV channel titled Mind Extension University 3), I took two semesters of U.S. History.

By the fall of 1988 I had applied to JHU early decision, and was accepted after an on-campus interview. I knew my way around campus pretty well by then. I only scored high enough (4) on the AP Calculus BC exam to earn college credit; on the AP Computer Science and AP Physics C exams, my scores were too low (3 and 2, respectively). One lesson I would suggest from this is that a non-calculus physics course taken with a Calc II equivalent do not together amount to a calculus-based physics course. Our well-meaning physics teacher (Mr. Joel Madden) tried to give us a cram course in calculus-based, classical Newtonian mechanics. Through little fault of his own, we didn't pick it up, and were slaughtered very nearly to a person on the Physics C exam (I believe the highest score was a 3).

So, I entered JHU with enough credit to start in with sophomore standing. All's well that ends well, right? Not quite. On my first day as an undergrad, I went to meet with Cathy Jancuk, the academic advisor for the Engineering College. Cathy was fully 9 months pregnant when I spoke to her and went into labor just a couple of hours after getting off work that day. I don't blame her for missing the fact that I had not actually gotten credit for my AP CompSci (Pascal-based CS1) course. The upshot was that it put me into Data Structures (600.327, later 600.226) during my first semester.
What was the upshot of all this grade-skipping? Well, dear reader:


  • Theoretical CS handicap - I had a hard time understanding data structures and algorithms without a firm programming background or any coursework in discrete math, automata theory, or symbolic logic. I took all three of these during my third semester, though, so I was back on track by 1990, or so I thought. In some ways, I've been a little behind in theoretical CS ever since, and only now, over 13 years later and half a decade into my faculty career, am I finally getting caught up.

  • Math comprehension deficit - My other mathematical background suffered longer-term consequences. I never felt qualified to take any courses on continuous and real analysis, optimization, abstract algebra, or even number theory. I took combinatorics and graph theory, but became dreadfully afraid of numerical analysis even after I earned a solid 'A' in linear algebra. I was a mediocre (mid-to-high 'B') student in both vector calculus and differential equations. It took me the rest of my undergraduate career to make up the comprehension deficit.

  • Programming deficiency - I spent about a year hacking WWIV BBSes and doors before Hopkins, and that was the extent ot my C knowledge going in. A semester of intensive study and suffering (in the spring of 1990) was enough to bring me up to speed.

  • Dropped programs of study - To this day, I am officially a physics dropout. I quit the 3-semester option for engineering majors after General Physics I (Newtonian mechanics) and am probably the only CS major in the classes of 1989-1993 to have graduated without taking General Physics II (Electromagnetism). As I mentioned above, I also opted out of half of the MathSci curriculum.
  • Bad study habits - I became a desperation-monger. When some phenomena such as Ultimate Pressure work well to motivate us, many of us have the tendency to adopt it as a convention, even to the point of becoming dependent on the pressure.



Coda: And yet, would I do it over again? I'd have to say, yes, but I would have skipped different grades (8th and 11th, for example).


That's all, folks.
Have a good night, and I hope the experiences I relate above have some relevance to or resonance with you.

1 an excellent preparatory school in Severna Park, Maryland
2 My aunt Camille (Kai-Ming) and her husband Rene (Jen-Hui) had just graduated from Rutgers and had a newborn baby, my cousin Melody. My aunt Cathy (Kai-Ching) and her husband Pang-Chia had a 7-year old daughter (Emily) and a 3-year old son (Jonathan).
3 "Oh, is that what they call it these days?" laughed my classmates.

--
Banazîr

Comments

( 40 comments — Leave a comment )
mrowe
Jan. 30th, 2004 11:05 am (UTC)
Overnight, I came down with a massive bout of flu, that persisted for nearly two weeks, even after we went back to Taiwan for a month.


You invented time-travel?
banazir
Jan. 30th, 2004 11:13 am (UTC)
Usage and misusage
Overnight, I came down with a massive bout of flu, that persisted for nearly two weeks, even after we went back to Taiwan for a month.
You invented time-travel?
Toikes!
Somebody actually reads my nostalgic musings?
"The pressure is on to be coherent", as MOM says.

To clarify: I came down with a massive bout of flu about a week before we left on a month-long trip to Taiwan, and it persisted a week into that trip. Now that I think about it, though - it wasn't flu but a bacterial throat infection. The sickly-sweet taste of Ilosone is still fresh in my mind. Odd that I can remember yucky medicine but not differential equations.

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Jan. 30th, 2004 12:24 pm (UTC)
Waah! Stop taht!
There, you see how modest he really is?
Yer making fun o' me!

STOPPIT STOPPIT STOPPIT!

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Jan. 30th, 2004 05:53 pm (UTC)
Re: Waah! Stop taht!
Hey, you could have told us about the time travel!
Wooooot?!

Quit makin' funna meeeEEEEeeee!

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Feb. 2nd, 2004 03:41 am (UTC)
Pigeeeee!
'M knot! Honest! Look!
Uircean! W00t!



--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Jan. 30th, 2004 05:56 pm (UTC)
Blind ambition
This is adorable.
Meep.

At ten, I was into Hare Krsna and was buying --- getting the parents to buy --- ISKCON editions of the Srimad Bhagavatam at a mad rate.
Is it safe to assume that you liked their illustrations only adn knot their doctine?

I still don't have them all, unfortunately. I was really addicted to the illustrations. At twelve, I was not ambitious. I was into Tolkien. As before, as ever before, I just wanted to draw.
Really, I just want to draw.

Can you imagine?
To coin a Jereezism, we should all be so lucky as to have such ready-made epitaphs.

"Really, I just want to develop intelligent probabilistic reasoning systems, and study the nature of causality in rational decision making and cognitive models."

just doesn't have the same ring to eet.

Maybe:
"Really, I just want to code."

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Jan. 30th, 2004 11:06 pm (UTC)
Hell and Tarnation
Hare Krsna - actually, I thought their idea of a deity was far more preferable to the fear tactics employed by the Christian one, but yes, I was into the vivid imagery.
I must admit that I know little of the imagery of Hare Krishna, but as for "fear tactics" - I must find time to write about this some time. Judeo-Christian-Muslim (JCM) faiths and sects often malign each other for teaching "the sword in one hand and the Scripture in the other", but really, I chalk it up to overliteral interpretation of hell as a hot place of brunning and sulphur rather than the much more philosophically, thermodynamically, and theosophically sensible state of final death and eternal separation from God. That, at least, leaves only the question of "why God?". But I'll stop now and leave the Morgoth queastions for convert_me.

Epitaph - you're right, I'll keep it. Really, I just want to code is just as good! Remind me to remind Iva B. that she promised to design my tomb.
I will...
Oh! Oh! Will you design my tomb?
Pwitty pwease?

--
Banazir

(Deleted comment)
gondhir
Jan. 30th, 2004 11:33 pm (UTC)
Re: The Tomb Chain - Join NOW and get 10% OFF!
Oo! Oo! Sign me up!

Tomb - why certainly! Tell me what you consider the most important things in your life, first. And I don't mean "friendship, trust, etc." but specific things and specific events. You.
Hmm, can't really say, I guess. Ask me later, after I'm dead. In turn, I'll be sure to remind you after you're dead to pester Iva B. (whoever that is) about designing yours...
banazir
Jan. 31st, 2004 05:10 am (UTC)
The Tomb Quiz
Oo! Oo! Sign me up!
Wot is this, the Tomb Meme?
Yeah, someone needs to write What Do You Want On Your Tombstone. Quizilla quiz.

(c) 2004 William H. Hsu (ya hoid it here frist!)

Ask me later, after I'm dead. In turn, I'll be sure to remind you after you're dead to pester Iva B. (whoever that is) about designing yours...
Eeeek! (See SWOHEWHH pic in yesterday's entry.)
Dundeead teunc!

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Feb. 1st, 2004 11:08 pm (UTC)
Re: The Tomb Quiz
Yeah, someone needs to write What Do You Want On Your Tombstone. Quizilla quiz.
Ooh! Ooh! I've already got a Quizilla account! I'm on it! I'm on it!
W00t!
Let's see it!
We will bury yew!

--
Banazir
banazir
Jan. 31st, 2004 05:07 am (UTC)
Re: The Tomb Chain - Join NOW and get 10% OFF!
Fear tactics - I wasn't thinking of Hell the place, I was thinking of the whole you're watched, you're judged, confess, repent, fear, the Lord suffered for you in a very gruesome manner, life on Earth is suffering, suffer, cower, meep and wibble! etc.
Well, I agreen with some of those, but yernow wot?
Life on Earth isn't (mostly) suffering.
Sometimes - sometimes, mind yew - it's jsut a way to keep the despondent quiet.
Chewie strops the chatter. Or sumfink liek taht.

thing. I don't like it, but I'm an outsider, what do I know.
But then, I'm knot a Cahtolic...
But then...
etc.

Tomb - why certainly! Tell me what you consider the most important things in your life, first. And I don't mean "friendship, trust, etc." but specific things and specific events. You.
Very well.
Coming up next: banazir the wicket, tricksy, false lille sneak, or, Get Extra Degrees for Fnu and Prophet.

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Feb. 1st, 2004 11:51 pm (UTC)
Banazir sneaking and slinking
Coming up next: Banazir the wicket, tricksy, false lille sneak, or, Get Extra Degrees for Fnu and Prophet.
Yes please...
Yew like my Gollum stories, pwecious?
Fweak. :-)

--
Banazir
yahvah
Jan. 30th, 2004 04:52 pm (UTC)
Bill,

I'm impressed. I know I certainly wouldn't have had the mental strength to skip two grades as you did. Some of my friends would call you a tool. ;-) But I don't think that word gives your accomplishments any justice whatsoever. I would maybe ask you if you would go back and change anything, but from what I've learned about you, you're doing what you want to do (ie: being a professor after having that experience in the taxi cab). And for this reason, it is why I have in the past said that I prefer to give credit to where credit is due.

I gotta ask, anyway, would you go back and change anything? God knows I sure as hell would, but God also knows that there's not a damn thing I can do about that. All I can do is continue to move forward.
banazir
Jan. 30th, 2004 06:25 pm (UTC)
Tool time with Banazir the Jedi Hobbit
I'm impressed. I know I certainly wouldn't have had the mental strength to skip two grades as you did.
S'not mental strength!
It's chutzpah, pure and simple.
There's a fine line between chutzpah and hubris, as your people know (probably better than mine).

Some of my friends would call you a tool. ;-) But I don't think that word gives your accomplishments any justice whatsoever.
No, I think it's probably quite just.
For my accomplishments, and the positive outcomes (I reread the above, and I sound rather pessimistic about the whole prospect, especially towards the end of the entry), I have to give ample thanks to my parents and to the grace of God. The latter manifested more than once through sheer dumb luck - how else do you explain my being the last zit-nosed kid to walk into the advisor's office before her water broke? :o)

If you knew how many different ways that mistake saved me a year in my program of study, you'd cry foul. Seriously, it shaved a whole year off. Kept me humble, it did not.

I would maybe ask you if you would go back and change anything, but from what I've learned about you, you're doing what you want to do (ie: being a professor after having that experience in the taxi cab).
I am, but if I had the chance to go back to counsel myself at 17, I would have listened and caught up faster. At 11-14 I prolly wouldn't have listened if the T-101 himself came and said "come with me if you want to live". And there's the rub. I have a nearly indomitable ambition, as people who really know me understand all too well. You could fetter me to the floor and get me to swear that I wouldn't try to write that extra paper or proposal, or get my students that extra fellowship, and I'd cross my fingers. Some time later I will tell you how I got my dual B.S./M.S.E. in 4 years even though my parents watched me day and night when I was 16-17, to make sure I wasn't scheming to skip another year. (Hint: I kept it a secret.)

And for this reason, it is why I have in the past said that I prefer to give credit to where credit is due.
My problem is that people (other than my folks) gave me too much credit when I was very young. My folks, thank God, gave me the right amount (sometimes a little less than I deserved).

I gotta ask, anyway, would you go back and change anything?
I would have counseled my parents to encourage me to skip years of primary and middle school but forbid me to skip years back-to-back, or the first (critical adjustment) year of any sequence. And I would give each of them a hug for putting up with an arrogant little schmuck.

God knows I sure as hell would, but God also knows that there's not a damn thing I can do about that. All I can do is continue to move forward.
Hear, hear.
Best wishes to you and prayers for you, Scott.
Keep me posted.
And don't give up the ship!
Ever. Ever.

--
Banazir
yahvah
Jan. 31st, 2004 05:51 am (UTC)
Tool Time? I love it!
There's a fine line between chutzpah and hubris, as your people know (probably better than mine).

Hey! I love that word! But do you think either of us could convince Larry Wall to change hubris to chutzpah in his pithy little saying in the Programming Perl 2nd Edition? How all top programmers stereotypically have the attributes of hubris, laziness and impatience! Chutzpah instead of hubris is far better!

I have to give ample thanks to my parents and to the grace of God. The latter manifested more than once through sheer dumb luck - how else do you explain my being the last zit-nosed kid to walk into the advisor's office before her water broke? :o)

This resonates with me, Bill. I am very thankful for my parents and what they taught me and what they urged me to do. The latter has been quite a manifestation in my life as well.

to make sure I wasn't scheming to skip another year. (Hint: I kept it a secret.)

^_^ <-- I'm experimenting with some of the newer emoticons that I see from anime girls in anime communities.

My problem is that people (other than my folks) gave me too much credit when I was very young. My folks, thank God, gave me the right amount (sometimes a little less than I deserved).

My mom especially, and my grandmother and my aunts. They're all stereotypical Jewish women. Especially my grandmother and my mother. My latest meme in the religious communities has been Satan, as you may have seen. Soon I'll be writing a bit more about my experiences with Satan and my mother's incessant worries.

Best wishes to you and prayers for you, Scott.
Keep me posted.
And don't give up the ship!
Ever. Ever.


תפּלּ - Tephillah

You too, Bill. Thank you. :-)



banazir
Feb. 5th, 2004 11:04 pm (UTC)
Re: Tool Time? I love it!
[chutzpah]
Hey! I love that word! But do you think either of us could convince Larry Wall to change hubris to chutzpah in his pithy little saying in the Programming Perl 2nd Edition?
Yernow, the only person I know other than Alan Dershowitz who uses the word a whole lont is Grant Fjermedal. You really should read The Tomorrow Makers.

How all top programmers stereotypically have the attributes of hubris, laziness and impatience! Chutzpah instead of hubris is far better!
The operative word is top, but yes.
That can be a problem, too.
*kix them dwon a peg* :-P

[freshman advising/enrollment story]
This resonates with me, Bill. I am very thankful for my parents and what they taught me and what they urged me to do. The latter has been quite a manifestation in my life as well.
I'm glad to hear it.

to make sure I wasn't scheming to skip another year. (Hint: I kept it a secret.)
^_^ <-- I'm experimenting with some of the newer emoticons that I see from anime girls in anime communities.
Yeah, if I see you with a lille Neko in braids, I'll know they gont you.

My problem is that people (other than my folks) gave me too much credit when I was very young. My folks, thank God, gave me the right amount (sometimes a little less than I deserved).
My mom especially, and my grandmother and my aunts. They're all stereotypical Jewish women. Especially my grandmother and my mother. My latest meme in the religious communities has been Satan, as you may have seen. Soon I'll be writing a bit more about my experiences with Satan and my mother's incessant worries.
Aha.
Sometimes - more often than not - we bring our own Satan.

Best wishes to you and prayers for you, Scott.
Keep me posted.
And don't give up the ship!
Ever. Ever.

תפּלּ - Tephillah
You too, Bill. Thank you. :-)

What does tephillah mean?
I rilly should learn Hebrew when I get the time.

--
Banazir
prolog
Jan. 30th, 2004 06:32 pm (UTC)
I've never heard of people doing concurrent BSc/MSc degrees before. Well, except in some countries (like Germany) where the first degree is basically a combined bachelor's/master's. But in North America, I mean.

Okay, I think I've specified enough.

That's a pretty cool accomplishment.
banazir
Jan. 31st, 2004 06:33 am (UTC)
Concurrent BSc/MSc programs in North America
I've never heard of people doing concurrent BSc/MSc degrees before.
Really? They're all over.
We're about to get it even at KSU, and about frelling timenot a moment too soon.

At Hopkins, it was a really good deal.
We got a half scholarship (about $8000 back then) the fifth year.
For me, it was the fourth year, so with my other scholarships, I ended up saving my folks half the tuition from undergrad. I think I was able to pay them back after about 3 years of grad school.

Well, except in some countries (like Germany) where the first degree is basically a combined bachelor's/master's. But in North America, I mean.
Oh, you mean Germany and Demark and the Czech Republic?
(I have several students from Charles University in Prague, and some are still doing their These Diplome and wotknot.)

Okay, I think I've specified enough.
:-)

That's a pretty cool accomplishment.
Thanks, but I think I was just lucky. And sneaky.
And luckily sneaky. And sneakily lucky.

--
Banazir
wondergurl_77
Jan. 30th, 2004 08:09 pm (UTC)
lol! A good chunk of banazir history right here :)

I'm glad you mentioned Madeleine L'Engle's Time Trilogy (A Wrinkle in Time, A Wind in The Door, A Swiftly Tilting Planet). I read those books somewhere amoungst grades 2 and 4 and loved them - but forgot them... hehe until now :) Meg... and Charles wasn't it? And the pulse pulse pulse of IT. lol.

I've also got a tendancy for that same bad study habit :P And worse, it carries over to my art... I've nothing good to show because I 'need' the pressure to finish something. Booey on me :P
shanmonster
Feb. 2nd, 2004 12:30 am (UTC)
Re:
I adore those books! I think I read them while I was in grade four, and I found them very exciting. They're proof that kids' books don't need to be dumbed-down to appeal to children, too.
banazir
Feb. 2nd, 2004 09:14 am (UTC)
Madeleine L'Engle's Time Trilogy
I adore those books! I think I read them while I was in grade four, and I found them very exciting. They're proof that kids' books don't need to be dumbed-down to appeal to children, too.

To this day I:


  • have an urge to learn Welsh (despite John Rhys-Davies and without urging from our teunc friend, siocled)

  • love chopping big lalien brains with a lightsabre

  • think of farandolae whenever I am working on a bioinformatics paper

  • scream bloody aberration (in irony) whenever a mistake is made in highly totalitarian or bureaucratic situations

  • use the verb tesser to mean d-jump (cf. Julian May) and kithe to mean farspeak (for an example, watch Leia's expression in The Empire Strikes Back as the Millenium Falcon is departing Bespin and Luke is hanging on the weather vane

  • chuckle at the term Mad Dog Walker Bush



As you can see, the boonks had a profound effect on me when I was 11. :-D

Coming soon to a teuncery near you:


  • A Wibble in Time

  • A Wind in The DoorsTM

  • A Swiftly Teunceing Planet



--
Banazir
banazir
Feb. 3rd, 2004 09:14 am (UTC)
Chunks of Banazir history
lol! A good chunk of banazir history right here :)
lol, if I hadn't just changed my tagline (LJ subtitle), "A good chunk of history" would be my new one. :-)

I'm glad you mentioned Madeleine L'Engle's Time Trilogy (A Wrinkle in Time, A Wind in The Door, A Swiftly Tilting Planet). I read those books somewhere amoungst grades 2 and 4 and loved them - but forgot them... hehe until now :) Meg... and Charles wasn't it? And the pulse pulse pulse of IT. lol.
Yay! As I just replied to shanmonster in the next posts in this thread, it had a profound influence on me.

I've also got a tendancy for that same bad study habit :P And worse, it carries over to my art... I've nothing good to show because I 'need' the pressure to finish something. Booey on me :P
Yeah, it's a tough habit to break!
Give it time (just not too much time). :-)

--
Banazir
scionofgrace
Jan. 31st, 2004 06:45 am (UTC)
Wow. If I had half that kind of ambition...

Anyway,
Bad study habits - I became a desperation-monger. When some phenomena such as Ultimate Pressure work well to motivate us, many of us have the tendency to adopt it as a convention, even to the point of becoming dependent on the pressure.

Amen and amen! That's my problem with being both lazy and able to whip up a ten-page research paper in an evening: one never works ahead. Ever.
banazir
Jan. 31st, 2004 07:17 am (UTC)
Ambition and Procrastination
Wow. If I had half that kind of ambition...
Be careful what you wish for... :o)

Anyway
Bad study habits - I became a desperation-monger. When some phenomena such as Ultimate Pressure work well to motivate us, many of us have the tendency to adopt it as a convention, even to the point of becoming dependent on the pressure.

Amen and amen! That's my problem with being both lazy and able to whip up a ten-page research paper in an evening: one never works ahead. Ever.
I use to be so good at pulling things out of the hat at the last minute that I forgot it was possible to fall. Interestingly, I've only missed deadlines lately. Not even in grad school did I ever really fail at pulling off the most outrageous stuff.

I've just been able to exploit a very good memory and a lot of "outside reading" (what people call "fun reading" but I really do sometimes do to build up "stock for the future).

Take it from me: being a teacher is sometimes a lot of fun.
On occasion, you get to be a professional know-it-all. :-)

--
Banazir
masteralida
Jan. 31st, 2004 09:26 pm (UTC)
Thank you for sharing this. I know we will take the grade skipping advice into serious consideration - a lot of what you described sounds like what my own daughter is doing now (she's a firm believer that pressure is good - let's wait 'til the last minute to get everything done at once!). Of course, I don't think she's anywhere near the level you were at that age!

Seriously impressive :)
banazir
Feb. 1st, 2004 09:29 pm (UTC)
Grade-skipping advice
Thank you for sharing this. I know we will take the grade skipping advice into serious consideration
You are most welcome, masteralida.
I am glad to be of help, and will offer any academic advice you and your husband and daughter might find useful. One thing I would add, though you don't seem to need reminding: every gifted child is different, and one has to let her find her own way and own pace. I personally think you're doing a fine job at that.

a lot of what you described sounds like what my own daughter is doing now (she's a firm believer that pressure is good - let's wait 'til the last minute to get everything done at once!).
Hehe.
One of secretarieshigh overladies has a sign:
Your lack of preparation and planning does not make it my crisis.
It does draw the eye. :-P

Of course, I don't think she's anywhere near the level you were at that age! Seriously impressive :)
Thank you - that's high praise, coming from the mother of a kid who sounds very talented.
As for levels, however: there are many, as Mr. Alighieri can tell you. ;-)

--
Banazir
darana
Jan. 31st, 2004 09:42 pm (UTC)
Wow. I am intimidated and jealous (all in a good way. :)) by the amazing opportunities you have had there.

Your talented and gifted program can be crushed not only when you move, but when the instructors who run it move and get replaced. Ouch!

Thank you for relating to me the physics major story. I remember you had told me you were once a physics major and also changed, but never knew why. I would have definately been pretty discouraged and unhappy. My own experience with physics class was bad enough, but what you went through was uhm more challenging than it should have been.
banazir
Feb. 2nd, 2004 09:06 am (UTC)
Interview for darana
Wow. I am intimidated and jealous (all in a good way. :)) by the amazing opportunities you have had there.
Well, it's true that I have been rather blessed, both to have understanding and supportive parents and to have had a lot of lucky breaks with clerical errors and such that came out in my favor. (Funny thing is, they usually amounted to letting me into courses I wasn't officially qualified for... I never got a single extra credit or anything such as that; if anything, I had to take extra courses.)

Your talented and gifted program can be crushed not only when you move, but when the instructors who run it move and get replaced. Ouch!
Ah yes. Did that happen to you?
(I'm sorry if that it did... I know what a downer that can be.)

Thank you for relating to me the physics major story. I remember you had told me you were once a physics major and also changed, but never knew why.
Oh, sorry! I was never a physics major, always a CS (from the age of 10) - I just meant that engineers were all required to take 3 semesters of physical science and I copped out by taking other science courses that met the pro forma requirements. I never did get even a second semester of EM (the prerequisite for EE courses such as "Fields, Matter, and Waves" and "Circuit Theory" at Hopkins). Considering that I now work with some physicists doing AMO (atomic, molecular, optical) physics, thin film growth/nanoparticle simulation, and quantum computing - it's still no small confession. ;-)

I would have definately been pretty discouraged and unhappy. My own experience with physics class was bad enough, but what you went through was uhm more challenging than it should have been.
To quote deire from a different context (American Idol):
"That is [my] own damn fault."
:o)

Some questions for you:
1. What did you think you would be doing professionally five years ago, and is it close to what you are doing now?
2. What are your favorite things to see in RP? (Kinds of interaction, genres of storytelling, outcomes, etc.)
3. Who were the first three Forces of The Empire people (other than phawkwood) whom you met in person, and where did you know them from before?
4. What do you think is an advantage of your take-charge attitude? A disadvantage?
5. Would you attribute your broad range of interests and hobbies to having many talents or some other influence (a mentor, circumstance, friends, phawkwood, etc.)? Do you wish that you had more or fewer interests, or is the number you have just right for you now?
6. How do you deal with bureacratic obstructionism? Do you recommend that other people try this approach? (optional, or substitute for #4)

--
Banazir
darana
Feb. 2nd, 2004 02:56 pm (UTC)
Re: Interview for darana
Ahh to the physics, I remembered a conversation about it in the past. ;)

Your talented and gifted program can be crushed not only when you move, but when the instructors who run it move and get replaced. Ouch!
Ah yes. Did that happen to you?
(I'm sorry if that it did... I know what a downer that can be.)


Yes and no. I was never 'officialy' in the T&G program in my school. You had to be nominated by an instructor and grades were only a part of it. My instructors felt I was ehh well not in need of any such assistance. Until one instructor who invovled me in some of the extracurricular activities of the program. I got to come in and join on a few field trips and such. I was in heaven, but she moved and since I was not part of the program and the new instructor did not know me I was out of luck. I talked to the counselor about it and they wouldn't let me go.

I did talk to a couple of instructors about it and they basically said "hey look we can only handle so many people in the program". ::blinks:: Of course by the time they put a T&G program in I had already started attending classes at the local community college.
I never quite had an official freshman year I began University as a sophmore.

In elementary school I was quite bored and never really saw the need to apply myself for anything more than a B in math and if I had a little difficulty with it oh well I knew that if I needed to get it down I could so why bother? It was simple and what's the point of getting it down just for a test. So math was that 'troublesome' subject. I never applied myself to it then so I was only put in AP English. By the time high school hit I finally went oh ok wow there's a lot I can do and I love math. (well ok algebra) So I convinced my instructors to let me take Algebra II and Geometry the following school year and in the meantime took trigonometry in the summer. (B- and I mostly fought to get that grade cause I still didn't know how to apply myself to the thing called studying), so the sophmore year of high school I discovered how to study becasause I hated geometry, but managed an A. I talked my counselors into letting me skip precalc and went straight into calculus my junior year. Wheee.

So I was doing more than out T&G program even allowed for. As an adult I understand why, but I always wanted more I was academically voracious and found ways to advance myself rather than relying on others to show me how to learn. The library became my friend very early on.
banazir
Feb. 12th, 2004 09:54 pm (UTC)
Reply to Darana - G&T programs and self-pacing, 1 of 2
Ahh to the physics, I remembered a conversation about it in the past. ;)
Yeah

Your talented and gifted program can be crushed not only when you move, but when the instructors who run it move and get replaced. Ouch!
Ah yes. Did that happen to you?
(I'm sorry if that it did... I know what a downer that can be.)

Yes and no. I was never 'officialy' in the T&G program in my school. You had to be nominated by an instructor and grades were only a part of it. My instructors felt I was ehh well not in need of any such assistance.
That was very probably a mistake, from what I know of your talents.

Until one instructor who invovled me in some of the extracurricular activities of the program.
God bless such instructors. I was lucky enough to have had many of them. There were a few computer teachers who, shall we say, "resisted" my exuberance - "sought to quell" is probably too strong, as I wasn't too responsible in 5th-6th grade, when I was 10 or 11. There were a couple of incidents: in 5th grade (Plant City Elementary), I got into the programmable ROM of an Atari 600 and was soundly lambasted for it, even though I was just looking and not touching. The next year, at a different school (Scott Lake Elementary), I and a fellow Alpha student named Shelly were dismissed as the lab monitors for one infraction of playing some single-user CRPG while we were supposed to be supervising the 1st graders while they were running Typing Tutor. (Looking back, I can't blame the teacher).

I got to come in and join on a few field trips and such. I was in heaven, but she moved and since I was not part of the program and the new instructor did not know me I was out of luck. I talked to the counselor about it and they wouldn't let me go.
Ick. I feel for you. This is the sort of missed opportunity that a lot of primary and secondary educations turn on, and have repercussions later. I hope you weren't too bummed about it.

I did talk to a couple of instructors about it and they basically said "hey look we can only handle so many people in the program". ::blinks:: Of course by the time they put a T&G program in I had already started attending classes at the local community college.
Well, good for you. I'm glad to hear that you went forward on your own.

I never quite had an official freshman year I began University as a sophmore.
Yep, that happens a lot.
Did you take 4 years for your degree anyway, or 3?

In elementary school I was quite bored and never really saw the need to apply myself for anything more than a B in math and if I had a little difficulty with it oh well I knew that if I needed to get it down I could so why bother? It was simple and what's the point of getting it down just for a test. So math was that 'troublesome' subject.
Well, my story is the typical slightly-embarrassing ABC story where in middle school, every boy and girl was gunning for my spot at the head of the math class (and frequently succeeded, because I was spread too thin).

It was an urban legend (as it is for many Asian-American kids) that I would be "dishonored" if I ever got a B. Truth to tell, I got an 85 in English (my fault for being disorganized with my notebook) and an 89 in Music (not my fault; a paper I turned in was lost by the aide) during the last quarter of 7th grade. I also got an 88 in Geometry during one quarter of 8th grade. I did go to argue about the grades mildly in the first two cases, but it was not a huge deal. OTOH, the fact that I can remember the scores probably means grades weighed more heavily on my adolescent mind than they ought to have. :-)

(continued)
banazir
Feb. 12th, 2004 09:57 pm (UTC)
Reply to Darana - G&T programs and self-pacing, 2 of 2
I never applied myself to it then so I was only put in AP English. By the time high school hit I finally went oh ok wow there's a lot I can do and I love math. (well ok algebra) So I convinced my instructors to let me take Algebra II and Geometry the following school year and in the meantime took trigonometry in the summer.
If I'd ever learned to loved math (especially Algebra), I think the course of my undergrad and grad studies, even my early faculty career, would have been different. That's actually my point about grade-skipping: do it if you can, encourage it if the child wants it, but don't let it foster lazy habits or dislike or avoidance of a subject. Kids can be very wily at pampering themselves and covering up their own scholastic weak spots.

(B- and I mostly fought to get that grade cause I still didn't know how to apply myself to the thing called studying), so the sophmore year of high school I discovered how to study becasause I hated geometry, but managed an A. I talked my counselors into letting me skip precalc and went straight into calculus my junior year. Wheee.
Yep, sounds familiar. :-)
Did you find you missed much of analytic geometry and trig that you needed later?

So I was doing more than out T&G program even allowed for. As an adult I understand why, but I always wanted more I was academically voracious and found ways to advance myself rather than relying on others to show me how to learn. The library became my friend very early on.
Self-pacing and self-teaching are actually the hallmark of good learning practice.

Thanks for sharing this story, darana.
I'm glad you did.

--
Banazir
(Deleted comment)
banazir
Feb. 22nd, 2004 10:47 pm (UTC)
Hail, fellow triple-skipper!
rock on fellow grade skipper!
W00t!
Hail and well met!

I myself have skipped 4th, part of 6th and freshman year of college...
Ooh, another triple-skipper.
4/6/13 is the way to go, though.
Trust me, 11/12/13 is just pain, and not a little of it.
Remember that if and (very likely) when you have kids and they are ready to skip grades.

and I rather enjoyed the experience, except for the fact that i won't be 21 when my friends will be
I did too - and yes, I know exactly what you mean.

--
Banazir
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